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Post by water_moon on Jun 16, 2009 14:28:43 GMT -5
The idea actually grew out of a mafia traitor idea. The problem is that I can't think of any way to have a mafia player who wins when the town wins (if that's what you mean by mafia traitor). You'd have to prohibit them from just straight up revealing the other mafia, and even with that prohibition in place, the obvious point of the role would be to subtly reveal the other mafia, and you'd have to draw a line somewhere. The game would likely come down to the judgements of the host as to whether ___ is a legitimate subtle hint or a straight reveal rather than anything from the group. -CG I did a round with a traitor who could chose which side they would go with N1, and two mafia groups, with niether group knowing which group held the traitor. The problem was it came down to 1 mafia vs. 1 traitor (he chose town) and I had to flip to see who killed who (they both targeted the other at that point). But I like the requirement to vote for the mafia at some point durning the day as a variation. I seem to recall another mafia game where the traitor couldn't open voting on any of their pals, but they could be "suspicious" all they liked and were free to bandwagon.
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Post by water_moon on Jun 16, 2009 14:34:12 GMT -5
W_M I seriously could not find the description of the seamtress in the notes. I thought if I came out knowing what it was and it turned out it had only been told to the mafia in our PM - I was in trouble if only the mafia knew the details. So I just said I didn't know that we had all been told about it and that is the truth.Ah, but I figured a bright townie or mafia would have gone back to check to SEE if we'd been told what a seamstress did. The underlined statement is to me a key to being a good mafia. The only time I have blatently lied as mafia (twist the truth oh yeah! but not make a false statment per se) is when I'm the last standing. And since I've avoided trying to claim townie even when I am, I dont' have to as mafa. I love being able to edit: Anyone want to get in the hosting que? Jason is up next but cg it sould like you have a few good ideas
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Post by soylentred on Jun 16, 2009 14:45:30 GMT -5
see you said 'bright'.
I did go back and look for it, couldn't find it and couldn't remember how I knew about it.
Except for my funny valentine claim - which was a whopper - I have never lied in the game - it makes it easier.
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Xanth
New Member
Posts: 27
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Post by Xanth on Jun 16, 2009 17:45:51 GMT -5
@w_M - There was no need to claim it. Why make a risky play for the win when we were absolutely coasting. Even if the reveal had happened earlier, there were still a couple options, because Jason's claim was the weakest it could POSSIBLY be (He investigated one person who was NK'd, and didn't get his second investigation in, so he offered 0 proof). We could have counter-claimed against that, but odds are pretty good we could have sat tight through it. None of us had any threat against us.
@nole - Still don't understand the mafia point system reference, but I did worry that I'd blown it by claiming not to know about the role reveals. It was the riskiest thing I wrote, and the town did a great job of nailing me on it. But my "don't lynch today" advice was still absolutely the way for the town to go in this game. I stand by that.
@soylent - Just so everybody else knows, I suggested "skip the night kill" on night 2 because we needed 1 lynch and 1 NK to get to the 50% win margin. To me, the order meant nothing, and I figured we would be safer with one more living member of the town. The ideal situation would be if the doctor protected a mafia member, and the town took the lack of death as proof that a mafia member was innocent. So it would be (lynch -> kill -> win) instead of (kill -> lynch -> win). The one thing I hadn't considered is that it's possible for a mafia member to die even at the 50% mark, depending on the speed that the votes get cast. Night 3's discussion involved the backup plan of rushing a lynch in case the doctor had picked correctly. We made it our mission to get 4 votes on W_M before the town could get 4 votes on one of us.
Thanks for the fun game. I'm up for another.
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Post by Jason Maher on Jun 16, 2009 20:50:49 GMT -5
@jason, p.s. I second the waiting until late in the day to claim cop was dumb as sin. You don't wait till 7pm if you're set to die at 8 to appeal. After my last post I signed off and went to bed, as had several other people. And frankly the only way to confirm it would have been to lynch you anyway. What suprises me is that the mafia didn't claim, sure it would a be a deadgive away to the cop, but it's also a perfect target/confusion thing and with 4 to 5 cutting one lose ould have been too easy. Sorry. I can't let that one slide. As I said in my previous post, I was assuming (as has been the case in every other game I've ever played) that there would be a rush of activity in the lead-up to the deadline. Giving 3.5 hours notice in those circumstances is more than enough, I would think. The problem is I had no intention of revealing if there was any other way of saving my skin (and the town's), and your vote on me - the 3rd - was 9 minutes before I posted the reveal (the intervening time being spent writing the post), and I've said before this was what triggered my reveal. What was really dumb as sin was not getting a PM in night 2. Since I had nothing after merlin's NK, an early reveal would have been a waste of time, and would probably have simply led to the counter-claim you expected. I note nole's point above again about people going after me and ignoring the rest of his lynch train. I'll admit what I did looked suspicious, but so did soyl, Fire, and goltar all voting in quick succession. Why am I the only one who picked that up? Is it perhaps that I had the extra motivation of not getting lynched myself? edit: @cg - feel free to host the next round.
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Post by colorlessgreen on Jun 16, 2009 21:08:07 GMT -5
I have exactly zero interest in hosting next round.
-CG
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Post by FIREHORSE on Jun 17, 2009 6:28:19 GMT -5
I seriously suspected goltar from RL clues so I was rather handicapped this round. (hence my attempt to emulate Sherlock Holmes and logic.) Sadly that lead me to underestimate soy, and actully take her "seamstress is unimportant" misread at face value. Xanth was also setting off rule alarms but with the town too close it wasn't safe to get rid of possible badies who may just be townies who weren't paying attention, which is normally not only safe but advisable. Bob wasn't on my radar but that's becasue FIREHORSE was too big a blip. So help me, the "I know I'm a townie so so-in-so going after me must make them a mafia" is a horrible arguement, and one that by logical extension means that since I knew I was a townie means whoever is making that statement against me must be a mafia. Talk about circular logic!!! If that rant was directed at me I think you misunderstood. I said that I most always appear to be mafia. And once I was. More of a commentary on my play style than whether or not to vote for me. That's all.
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Post by water_moon on Jun 17, 2009 17:33:22 GMT -5
Bob wasn't on my radar but that's becasue FIREHORSE was too big a blip. So help me, the "I know I'm a townie so so-in-so going after me must make them a mafia" is a horrible arguement, and one that by logical extension means that since I knew I was a townie means whoever is making that statement against me must be a mafia. Talk about circular logic!!! If that rant was directed at me I think you misunderstood. I said that I most always appear to be mafia. And once I was. More of a commentary on my play style than whether or not to vote for me. That's all. Actully that was in response to this statement: ....She seems to be after me and I know I am Town. So WM you are on my radar ... This is a horrible example of logic and a wonderful example of veiled threats used as psycological persuasion. After all, mafia do like to make offers you can't refuse.... But my "don't lynch today" advice was still absolutely the way for the town to go in this game. I stand by that. Not with the way the rules were worded. The possiblity that a mafia could jump in and vote at the last second, there by getting a free mafia hit is just too dangerous. They could even try to weasle their way out the next day with a "I hadn't realized no one had voted/all the votes had been recinded, I was in a rush and trying to get something in before the last second." Or, "I only got to post number *blah*(before the town agrees to a no vote day) and so-in-so was screaming mafia to me and I had to vote before it was too late" And the biggest problem? If that happens not only do we end up in a must-lynch situtation, we'd be there with less liklyhood of a doc and cop both. The ONLY way delaying the inevitable would make sense would be if the rules were enforced as the seamstress MUST pick a target every night, and since they can only target a given person once, at some point they end up having to pick mafia and hope that person is not randomly chosen as the hitman for the night. >I actully thought that might be the case in this game ("[the seamstress] sends me a PM once per night with the name of one player. Any actions of that player are blocked and have no effect for that night.") and that's what soy was refering too with regards to the town having a hidden advantage, which would also explain the night going forward. <
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Post by Jason Maher on Jun 17, 2009 20:50:27 GMT -5
Well if I'm next I'll get to dreaming up a game set-up. Probably go for something simple. Complex doesn't work too well with a small group.
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Post by merlin on Jun 18, 2009 12:16:02 GMT -5
Once again I made a mess out of it. I'm guessing it's mostly my fault the mafia had such an easy round this time. Sorry bout that. I'll have to think about signing up for another round. I need to find some skill first.
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Post by Noodle on Jun 27, 2009 18:26:31 GMT -5
Yeah, my employer blocked this site. They're cracking down a bit.
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